I talked about my three layoffs on a podcast. It was hard, but not for the reasons I thought

How telling my story on the “I Lost My Job” podcast helped me process — and appreciate — the real impact of my layoffs have had on me.

TL;DR: I was on Jackie Shu’s I Lost My Job podcast to talk about my three layoffs in three years. If you want to jump straight to listening, you can use the player below or find more links at the bottom of this essay.

I had a great time on the podcast, which was initially a big step outside my comfort zone. This essay walks through my experience, thoughts, feelings, and the surprises I found along the way — before, during, and after recording.

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When Jackie Shu, host of the ‘I Lost My Job’ podcast, reached out to me on LinkedIn about being a guest on her show, my first instinct was to figure out what the scam was.

I mean, who wants to talk to me about a layoff? Millions of people have been laid off over the last five years — I didn’t feel particularly exceptional.

Sure, I’ve been laid off three times. But surely I’m not alone.

And yes, I’ve written about my layoffs. On LinkedIn, on this Substack, and each time seem to have more and more to say.

But that didn’t make me feel qualified to be a guest on a podcast. I know firsthand that having a lot to say in the written word is not the same as saying it out loud.

Jackie had never heard me speak and only seen my writing — she doesn’t know that I’m much more coherent when I write.

When I speak out loud, I ramble. I jump the gun. I interrupt. I speak too quickly but also not quickly enough (per some feedback from a former boss)¹. If I were to make a ‘top list of qualities a podcast guest should have,’ it wouldn’t be those.

I’ve thought about a podcast or a YouTube channel² for years, but have never committed to the idea. These forms of media really thrive on planning and scheduling, and I don’t thrive on those things. I think I could get really into the editing process, but I also know it’s a time suck.

They also thrive on having a certain air, a persona, a demeanor that translates well to audio and video. A demeanor that I’ve never felt I’ve had.

Even knowing all of this, my curiosity was piqued. While I gave myself all of the reasons why I’d be a terrible podcast guest, I also knew that it was a medium I was at least curious about being a part of. I also reminded myself that there’s a chance that I might be too hard on myself, and that, if someone else is given the reins to steer the conversation, I might actually have something of value to say.

And so, instead of ignoring this DM on LinkedIn, I replied³.

I enthusiastically agreed to chat with her to learn more about her vision and so we could decide if having me on an episode of her podcast would feel like a fit for us both.

Between scheduling a chat with Jackie and our meeting the next day, I went to listen to her podcast. I thought I’d listen to an episode just to get a sense of what it was all about, but found myself so invested in the conversations that I couldn’t peel myself away.

Jackie’s goal with I Lost My Job is to tell stories behind layoffs in a place that isn’t just LinkedIn. She started the podcast when she found herself laid off from a job and was looking for another place to turn. She couldn’t find that place online, so she created it herself.

She wants to humanize people, help them share their stories, and hopefully create a space where we all feel less alone.

I was immediately struck by the honesty of these conversations and how at ease Jackie seemed to be while interviewing — she really does have a knack for it.

That feeling carried over to our first chat. Talking to Jackie was easy, and I immediately knew I wanted to join her on the show. By the end of our time together, we’d scheduled the interview for the following week. I guess my rambling didn’t scare her off, but I did warn her editing my episode could give her a run for her money.

The hour we had scheduled to record flew by — the conversation felt really organic and easy, even though I was nervous and talking about something pretty heavy. We walked through my three layoffs, what I learned from each one, and what I’m hoping for in the future. There were, of course, things I forgot to share (like the fact that when I was laid off while pregnant, I also took on a few part-time jobs babysitting just to bring in some income), but overall, I think I said what I wanted to.

After we were finished recording, Jackie said something to the effect of “I know these conversations can be draining, so thanks for talking through all of this with me”.

My initial reaction was something to the effect of What? No! That was fun! I feel great!

If anything, I was on a bit of a high. The nervousness I was carrying into the interview had dissipated, and while I knew I’d rambled, I also felt good about the conversation. I was invigorated, thinking about how I could become a guest on even more podcasts. It felt easier than I thought it would, and I learned that sometimes, it’s really important to just take that leap of faith.

But later, I started to understand what she meant.

Our interview ended at 3:30 pm, and a few minutes later I was hit with the stark realization that nothing else was getting done that day.

Slowly, a headache set in. My focus was shot, and I felt exhausted.

I was exhausted. Mentally exhausted, but also physically. I hadn’t realized how emotionally taxing each of these experiences was until I sat down and talked about them all together.

I took for granted that these were moments in my past linked to a moment in my present, and didn’t understand that reliving them, one after the other, would send part of me back there (and also seemed to bring a part of me I left behind into the present).

The next morning, I woke up and still felt a little foggy, but felt lighter. I was proud of myself for having taken the leap, and I think overall it was important for me to talk this out and tell my story. It was such a fun experience, and while I’ve touched on my layoffs throughout the last three years, this really was the first time I’ve told all three stories, end to end, in a space where this conversation was at the center.

My hope for agreeing to be interviewed was multifaceted. One, I wanted to see if I could do it, and if I’d enjoy it.

I also wanted to have this particular conversation on this particular podcast (with this specific host). I felt really comfortable with Jackie right away, and knew she was the one I wanted to help tell this story.

I wanted to push myself outside of my comfort zone and to start to dismantle the narrative that I’m not an audio/video person. That maybe, if I decide that I care enough (and with enough practice), I could break into this media if I choose. I’m not convinced I want to yet, but I think the connotations of saying that’s not for me are very different from saying I could do that, I just don’t have space for it right now.

I wanted a place to process all I’ve gone through in three layoffs, and I wanted to, for once, not be the one steering the conversation. It was really nice to let go of the reins and let someone else be in charge.

And finally, I hoped that at least one person who needed that conversation would find it. Perhaps someone who has been laid off multiple times, or has a partner who has been laid off multiple times; perhaps someone who was laid off while pregnant; maybe someone who feels that this market is especially bad but has started to wonder if it’s just them (it’s not you — this market feels crazier than any I’ve experienced).

One thing Jackie and I discuss is that, while we both believe layoffs are bad, there is a reality that, at some point, the aftermath may lead to something good. That’s different than saying they’re purposeful or have a silver lining.

I hope that one of the ‘good aftermath’ things of not only my layoff but others’ experiences is that we’re all primed to have more of these conversations more often.

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I Lost My Job is hosted on Zencastr and is also available on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. I hope you listen — if you do, let me know what you think of the conversation.

1. Not what this story is about, but…

2. Not counting the YouTube channel I actually did have, back in 2007 when I was in high school, before vlogging was something that could make you a millionaire. Back then, it was weird at best. Again, not what this story is about…

3. Well, before I replied, I did a quick search to confirm that yes, Jackie is a real person (who was also recently laid off). I confirmed she has a real podcast and is most definitely not running a scam.

And then I replied.